sta2 classic mod and my personal mod

posted on March 4th, 2013, 10:17 pm

I have certain coding in my RTS_CFG file that is unique, like changing scrolling distance and a few other things (one of the mods I used had a file that did that, think its this file and I liked the distance they changed it to). There is also increased increased UI Limits for each resource that I've increased, along with a few other values, that I don't believe match Blade's file, the differences in increase are needed for how the game progresses through each era, without them, both the player or the AI will eventually get stuck.

In my opinion, the extra coding Blade added to the RTS_CFG file isn't really that important when you take a full look at it. It references FleetOps sound files that aren't in STA2, especially since the very last lines of coding reference two FleetOps maps that aren't even in stock A2.
Logically it seems its a waste of extra coding that the game doesn't need, especially if you're trying to stick with classic Star Trek Armada II, thus I don't see Blade's point for adding it.

I'm using a mod for shields and damage that I like very well and wish FleetOps was using it as well.
I'm using Project Orange - Damage Effects Mod by FahreS: http://armada2.filefront.com/file/Project_Orange_Damage_Effects_Mod;99496
I'm using the "Shields are down effect #2", there's nothing around the ship, but you can see the damage.

In my opinion that fits more to the canon aspects of Star Trek, after you don't see the shields spinning around a damaged ship that's lost them onscreen now do you? Plus I've never seen a damaged ship in FleetOps, they all seem to go up in magnificent explosions before they can be saved. But either way, I like my shields for my mod to look real (as in close to canon as possible). I don't get the feel that FleetOps' shields live up to that yet, of course that might change.

Pretty much that's why I want my mod to be a standalone mod, the STA2_Classic Mod overrides and negates many of the important aspects of my mod thus negating its effect as well. Using one mod as a Parent Mod can drastically ruin the effects and game play of a "Child Mod" yet no place in the guide do they warn about this, or show any sign of caring. In my opinion that they choose one way to add stock mods to FleetOps' Mods Directory and left it at that with: "A like it or not attitude, you have to do it this way, its the way we support stance". That's my opinion because: "Why else is there no other possible options, how come they didn't think about making a guide for creating standalone mods?" "How come there's no threads for the steps taken to create the STA2_Classic Mod?"
Have you or anyone noticed that after Blade released his, all work and postings on other mods that were attempting to port stock STA2 into FleetOps just died? I noticed this during my search on how to create a standalone mod throughout the modding forums.

posted on March 5th, 2013, 1:41 am

As far as I'm understanding it the child mod, your mod will take precedence and your files will be the ones used, however we see that isn't exactly the case in every circumstance like I mentioned about the shields. You're RTS_CFG UI values and resources and such "should" still be used even though there is an RTS_CFG file in the Classic mod. That's where experimenting comes in.

So, "you've" decided what's needed in the Classic mod and what's not and just deleted whatever you felt like? I'm of the mindset that Blade put the coding there for "some" reason or else why bother doing it in the first place?

#define cfgSOUND_SHELL_MUSIC "Mfed300.wav" is in the Classic mod sound folder so that seems relevant.

The .ogg sound files listed are in the Fleet Ops sound folder so those seem relevant.

That map reference, mp08walr.bzn with the name Warzone, that's a stock map in Armada 2, look in your bzn folder and you'll see it. So seems relevant.

Comparing other files against mine/stock I see that the file sizes are different so Blade must have edited them in some manner to work with Fleet Ops like the armada2.map file and the Armada2.pdb file for instance.

Blade put together the classic mod for one reason, to import stock A2 to Fleet Ops. He provided guidelines to use his mod as a parent and at the time that was sufficient. If someone wanted to make a stand alone mod I sure haven't found any threads on it. Maybe you're the first and finding out the pains involved. Blade doesn't recall how he put it together so there's no use focusing on that aspect or why he didn't have the foresite to provide instructions on how to make a stand alone mod. That's just life. So you've taken the bull in the china shop approach and crashed your way through deleting his stuff and adding your own when you don't even know what specifically is needed and now it won't work. Time to step back and start over in my opinion.

posted on March 5th, 2013, 1:45 am

In several cases Blade by accident added the wrong bit of coding, or copied some stuff he shouldn't. Should be fixed with v4.

The reason in general it is recommended to use the A2Classic mod simply because it is easier and the vast majority of mods were built to use stock a2.

No guide exists on how to mod something without doing so, but eventually I may create one. I only have so much motivation and time in the world . Should be easy to create your own A2Classic mod and use that as a basis.

posted on March 5th, 2013, 3:04 am

Thanks D_N. So are you saying that when v4 of FO is released someone, Blade or the FO team is planning on reworking the STA2 Classic mod to work with it?

posted on March 5th, 2013, 3:07 am

Yup, Blade has stated that he would re-release the A2 classic mod to correct those bugs. The bugs on our side (development) will also be removed with regard to certain 'classic' missing features

[Je_mezu24]

posted on March 5th, 2013, 4:47 am

Last edited by Je_mezu24 on March 5th, 2013, 5:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

@Dominus_Noctis: (1) In a post in one of my threads or one I commented to Blade told me in a post that he forgot what he did to make the STA2_Classic Mod actually work as a FleetOps Mod. So I raise the question: How can he fix something he forgot how he made work? Unless he was pulling my leg on what he did just to keep it secret.

@Rifraf: I never deleted anything from the files copied into my STA2_Generational Mod from the STA2_Classic Mod. In fact my mod doesn't have the RTS_CFG file in it from the STA2_Classic Mod since I've decided it wasn't holding relevant information for my mod to even work with FleetOps. Like I said before, I used my Pre-modded file and if the coding was needed I would have added it to my file, it linked directly to files directly in FleetOps' Sounds Directory and weren't even .wav files but .ogg.

The extra sound coding is added after the line #define cfgSOUND_SHELL_MUSIC "Mfed300.wav" is actually the last line of coding in the stock Armada II RTS_CFG file and the coding in the STA2_Classic Mod's RTS_CFG file has its extra coding directly underneath that line. Did you actually check the stock A2 file to the STA2_Classic Mod's file to notice that? That is why the referenced sound file is in the stock games sound file because stock automatically referencs it.

I will post a copy of the stock file and the changed STA2_Classic Mod's file when I have the chance. Ok, the map is in stock A2, but isn't needed in that file, you'll notice it isn't in the stock version of that file if you check.

Like I said before, I've checked stock and classic files to find out about any changes and to find out if its relevant and needed, how come the STA2_Classic Mod works without it?

You are over reacting, there is no need to start over and furthermore everything didn't work using Blades' steps for using the STA2_Classic Mod as a parent mod to my STA2_Generational Mod because using it as a parent mod as I've said before and more than once resulted in crash after crash with not one bug report to mention what the possible problem was so in fact, since I'm actually getting bug reports and that the fact FleetOps freezes before I can get to look at them just means I'm making progress because the crashes well using the STA2_Classic Mod as a parent mod never got to the point that my mod runs to trying to make it a standalone mod, so logically speaking, progress is actually being made by going against the illogical idea of having a "Parent Mod" and a "Child Mod" especially when all evidence I've been having with different mods, the Parent Mod overrides all the major files in the Parent Mod, only ones that I never had overrode by the Parent Mod was the GUI_Global file and the tech1 file, all the other ones I needed were overrode from all tests I've run creating a parent mod and child mod with minor additions to test.
So the most pains I've found with modding with the STA2_Classic Mod was in fact using it as a Parent Mo, I'm encountering less problems making it standalone for at least it launches, before it wouldn't even do that.only time it crashes is when trying to start the campaigns or clicking on "Instant Actuon".

On top of that Blade said right in another thread that it gets harder to add new races to the STA2_Classic Mod:

from the thread on this page: //www.fleetops.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=41&t=12145&hilit=Races+sta2_classic
posted on Fri Mar 01, 2013 6:31 am
addings ships and weapons should b pretty much same as stock a2 its the more complex stuff like races and tc were it gets trcky

Of course no further inquiry on that was made by him, just said that and left it at that.

Attachments

RTS_CFG.h

RTS_CFG file from stock STA2 (Actually my mod's Stock Version)

(17.3 KiB) Downloaded 255 times

RTS_CFG.h

RTS_CFG file from the STA2_Classic Mod

(17.45 KiB) Downloaded 262 times

posted on March 5th, 2013, 5:05 am

The reason the RTS config file in the A2 Classic Mod has those entries is because Blade didn't know that the default entry is A2's settings - i.e. using mp08walr.bzn or Warzone, etc. RTS config entries that reference something exclusive to FO's installation are mistakes (not sure even if there are any in there). http://guide.fleetops.net/guide/modding ... g-elements

[...]How can he fix something he forgot how he made work? Unless he was pulling my leg on what he did just to keep it secret.

Because he can relearn.

posted on March 5th, 2013, 5:24 am

Well if he can relearn as you say, this time I'd suggest actually writing down the steps so everyone can use them to either make a standalone mod or actually mod the STA2_Classic Mod because other total conversion mods for stock A2 can be modded by their users to have other ships, stations and races added to them, those were simple though, now it should be the same with the STA2_Classic Mod with the FleetOps engine, its only logical, plus its the smart thing to do respectfully.

posted on March 5th, 2013, 4:38 pm

@Je_mezu: I didn't mean starting over from scratch, I meant starting over with the questions you had and the problems you were encountering which is why I started over in your mod/questions thread by asking the questions from the beginning and listing the problems since all you keep saying is that no one has ever answered your questions. Don't overreact.

I assumed the coding Blade put in the Classic mod was needed which is why I said so. How was I supposed to know there are actually mistakes/extra code until Dominus said as much? Since you obviously know more about it than me I guess you should write the new STA2 Classic mod. Oh, and no disrespect.

You said you deleted a bunch of files and folder from the Classic mod and input yours instead to make a standalone. I was just operating under the assumption that deleting something in the Classic mod is what's affecting yours, but don't mind me.

posted on March 6th, 2013, 12:37 am

@Rifraf: It sounded like you were saying to start over with the mod.
I really don't want to start over with asking every question that I have asked over again. I really don't have the time to do that actually, I know it may not look it here but I have lots of things to do outside of STA2.

When it comes to the extra coding, I only figured it out from what SquireJames was saying when I asked about the files that he said Blade had edited with "FleetOpsy" coding. I decided to check them out further and only that file (RTS_CFG) as of now seems to have un-relevant coding added to it.

From the files SquireJames said were edited for STA2_Classic Mod with extra coding, I've added those coding additions if they seemed possible that it might be needed, if not I've made a note of the change and moved on to other files.