Shadow Class (3.0.7)

[Tyler]

posted on August 25th, 2009, 12:06 pm

Last edited by Tyler on February 15th, 2010, 3:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

The Romulan Shadow Class. Both have a Disruptor and Cloaking Device, while the Avatar's add either a Particle Weapon or an Experimental Pulse Disruptor. Along with general system upgrades.

Dan1025's original Readme is included (since telling people where it comes from obviously isn't enough, I need it in writing too).

To Gamer: Sorry, but your ideas were a little complicated for me. Though, I learned something about FO weapon modding while ttrying.

Attachments

FO Shadow Class.rar

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posted on August 25th, 2009, 12:09 pm

Screenshots of the avatar ships.

Auto Destruct is in the tooltips because I have it in my game, it isn't actually included in this mod nor do the ships had odf entries for it.

Attachments

posted on August 25th, 2009, 12:12 pm

Shiny! 
One of my favourite Rom ships! Thanks for bringing it to FO!

posted on August 25th, 2009, 1:04 pm

Always did like that ship

posted on August 25th, 2009, 1:20 pm

That's a lot of windows for a ship with only 90 crew members.

posted on August 25th, 2009, 1:30 pm

Indeed. for that amount of windows it should have a crew of 200 IMO. The desighis really great. Nevertheless i dont see it that much combat oriented and rather a science and intelligence or command-vessel (which fits the large crew better than a comat vessel). I'd appreciate less firepower and more specials.

Nevertheless, great work! 

[Tyler]

posted on August 25th, 2009, 1:34 pm

Last edited by Tyler on August 25th, 2009, 1:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

A ships purpose has nothing to do with it's appearance, besides it's a Tal Shiar design so there is no real distinction. As for the crew, any ship not intended to board the enemy would have the crew scaled down during war. Romulans included, the Dominion and Borg are the only ones that don't care about their crew to some level.

Nevertheless, great work! 

Thanks

posted on August 25th, 2009, 1:40 pm

Hmmmm...... I wonder... have you asked a Dev to help with what you cannot figure out?

Anyway, I like it... maybe version 1.5 can have those other abilities I mentioned.

Keep it up... you just might be helping FO evolution advance more than you think!

posted on August 25th, 2009, 1:44 pm

A ships purpose has nothing to do with it's appearance.

This statement is absolutly correct for warped in vessels, refits and so on. But if you are building a new ship, the design of the ship will be fitting the porpose in a perfect way. Noone designs and builds a ship that isnt best fitting. Bulding a ship with high possible crew capacity in times of war is a waste of resources, as long as it is no science or boarding vessel. Further high possible crew capacities (which are intended by the large windowed areas, and the bulky central area in general) mean the ship has additional mass to carry that is inappropriate in war, as it costs much nauverability. This is the same way the valdore is a pure warship and the d'deridex not: Further a high distance between the wings ends grants higher manuverability.

I believe this reasons are quite understandable.

posted on August 25th, 2009, 1:54 pm

I can understand your points. They don't cover all ships, though. The Negh'Var for example should be a science ship by that logic because it isn't a fitting design for a warship (too big with crap manuverability, it's weapons are the only good point to it and they only help to a limited degree).

The Sovereign also hasn't shown much Science capability, only combat-based ones. It's mass is second-only to the Galaxy and has an big crew too, but hasn't should itself to be designed to board.

posted on August 25th, 2009, 2:07 pm

Should I have to explain?

The Feeration often try to have a good amount of crew as you can see through their well textured window patterns. (Which would be cool if you coul see people walking across the windows.) It is well executed that the Federation try to have a decent crew without having the ship over crowded.

The Borg have no windows because all of their views are seen via the Holo-Screen as featured in "Best of Both Worlds". The Borg literally don't even carre to see the stars they fly by because they only care about what their objective is.

The Klingons like to have lots of Armor, they often limit windows to Senior officer quaters and sometimes their dining halls. Other than that it is all armor. So don't rely on the window pattern to determine the crew. The only exceptions are TMP-era vessels which featured an abundance of windows to clearly show where most of the crew is.

The Romulans are a bit similar to the Feds. Though they only have their windows limited specifically to the command area. Which sometimes the windows can be slightly deceving. But yes if there are a lot of visible windows there should be plenty of crew.

The Dominion only would have windows on their stations. Because on ships the Vorta and Jem'Hadar 1st get those little lens things allowing them to see the entire outside of the ship.

[mimesot]

posted on August 25th, 2009, 2:15 pm

Last edited by mimesot on August 25th, 2009, 2:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

The NeghVar is indeed a strange vessel and i dint understand why it is that big and plump. But at least it has much weapon-power with it. The main cannon utilizes much of the space of the head and neck.

I don'g get why you take the sovereign as example, as it directly upports my point (well, as most federation vessels). It is a semi-civilian vessel. Loads of windows  :lol:, a large habitant area hat houses a big crew, which is of cours not meant for boarding. The design prvides a narrow location of the impulse-engines, which is unlikly for a warship either, as this takes away manuverability.

Nevertheless canon tells about the feds ships as advanced in manucerability, which is unbelievable, but well,  its the federation so they are advanced for sake of the story.

It is also illogic why the sovereign is a buildable ship at all, as it does not make sense to build a ship with such a large saucer section at all (which is mostly used for the crews habitat and not for weapons and ammunition storage). The reason is not that this is a good warship, no. We want to see the ship looking like the Enterprise-E ingame. In times of war it would be sensible to remove the saucer at all and replace it with a small pylon that carries all weaponary.

And now i ask myself again. Is there a good reason to do something not conclusive, a necessity that urges you to incorporate a bad combat design (nothing todo with the beauty of that ship) into the game?

EDIT: In starwars there is a good reason for the massice design of the ships: Its the housing of the hypermatter-nnihilator, that uses up nearly the whole inner space of the cental body. In Star trek there are no hige devices. The AM-tanks can be housed everywhere, and the core is quite small.

[Tyler]

posted on August 25th, 2009, 2:21 pm

Last edited by Tyler on August 25th, 2009, 2:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

But yes if there are a lot of visible windows there should be plenty of crew.

Ok, lets increase the D'deridex and Tavara crew to about 1000...maybe put the Galaxy at 1014 and the Negh'Var to over 2000. Crew in FO is limited for a reason.

The Shadow is a ship of the Romulan Guard (and likely the Tal Shiar). The Tal Shiar version would likely be a Science ship, but one working for the Guard would likely be a conventional Cruiser (maybe with an interesting weapon or two).

I don'g get why you take the sovereign as example, as it directly upports my point (well, as most federation vessels). It is a semi-civilian vessel. Loads of windows  , a large habitant area hat houses a big crew, which is of cours not meant for boarding. The design prvides a narrow location of the impulse-engines, which is unlikly for a warship either, as this takes away manuverability.

Starfleet is a Military, not a partly civilian organization and the ships are the same. There were never any civilians seen on a Sovereign, anyway.

And now i ask myself again. Is there a good reason to do something not conclusive, a necessity that urges you to incorporate a bad combat design (nothing todo with the beauty of that ship) into the game?

Not a bad design, just different. It's shape is about as 'bad' as every Dominion warship that is bigger than the Destroyer.

posted on August 25th, 2009, 2:25 pm

Dan1025's original Readme is included (since telling people where it comes from obviously isn't enough, I need it in writing too).

Correct. That's exactly how it works.

Being sarcastic about it doesn't help, as I'm just looking out for you. Lots of people have caused problems in the various communities by not having the credits in the readme. Basic modding etiquette.

I'm not criticising anything else, btw, I think it's great you're doing these conversions. All been great so far. =)

posted on August 25th, 2009, 2:50 pm

Well, the sovereign is a military vessel by canon, nevertheless its desigh tells something different. The cross section shows that a great amount of the space is used for crew commartments and other "civilian" usage. It rather reminds me of the queen elizabeth then of the bismarc.

Concerning the dominion ships i ask myself what fool designed them. As long as they dont have a hypermatter annihilator or something like that, which takes away huge amounts of continuose space there is no reason why these sheps have such a huge central body. Well, pherhaps they are hollowed in the middle.  The design may be beautiful, but its not made my a military engeneer.

Same goes for the sovvie. The desigh would make an excellent exploration and trade/travel-ship, but constructing saucersections in times of war is ridiculous.

And a design is bad if supports any unnecessary features that prohibit the intended need. In especial heavy parts that cannot be used in times of war.

The d'dederidex is not s warship too and thus not really conclusive why it should be built. It is logical that, when the empre sends d'dederidexes as combat support that they are not fully crewed, as not all of this crew is needed. But i would not build a ship with crew compartments for 1000 people if i'm in war an will only use as few people as necessary. The d'dederidex thus is a bad design fow was too.

I'm not telling that these thing should change, and the sovereign and the d'dederidex should become warpins too, it's just that i want to demonstrate, how urealistic it is that these ships are buildable.